Curse

BrotherReins · Aug 04, 2005, 09:12 PM // 21:12

more.. character.. slots..

Damon Windwalker · Aug 04, 2005, 09:16 PM // 21:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by BrotherReins

more.. character.. slots..

You already said that. Stop spamming.

Beta Ray Bill · Aug 04, 2005, 09:18 PM // 21:18

re: state of the game letter

I'm very much looking forward to the added content. I play PvE almost exclusively because, a) I like exploring the content and b) I suck at PvP. Yeah, I'd like to learn to become better, but as said above, there's precious little room for a lvl 20 character to learn new tricks well enough to fit in with the hardcore PvPers.

My only real concern about the latest announcement was Observer Mode. I was under the impression that we'd be able to see HoH battles as well, but the letter mentions battles around the Hall of Heroes. Does this mean we can't actually watch HoH battles or am I reading this wrong? Being a poor PvP fighter, this may be the only way for me to even see the hall.

re: the big bad nerf bat & drop rates

Granted, I've taken my sweet time getting to the so-called "good" farming areas, so I've probably missed the best season for farming, but since that's not been my goal, I really don't care. I ran the Fissure 3 times last night, those being my first 3 runs in either the Fissure or Underworld and I had a blast!

I've heard about how some players used to get 2-3 gold items per run and now they whine that they barely get 1 gold or purple drop per run. Last night, I managed to score a shard, a gold wand and a purple ankh -- the only items of note for 3 runs. On my last run, one teammate got 3 chaos axes and another got 1 ecto and 1 shard. I finally got my purple ankh which I sold at the merchant because it wasn't very good.

My point is this: I didn't complain. Sure, I would like to have gotten better drops, but I didn't. Even when my teammates were getting GREAT drops and I got mostly dust and shadow weapons, I didn't complain and I didn't ask them to share the wealth. Who am I to complain about the luck of the draw? Next time it could be me getting shards, ecto and cool weapons and my teammates may lose out. At least I got good xp and enough gold to cover my entry fee (125g in a party of 8) and then some.

re: Nature's Renewal

I play elementalist primarily, and I gave up on enchantments long ago. Fighting mesmer mobs out in PvE, the first thing they go for is stripping your enchantments and hexing you. It makes for a limited repertoire, but I'd rather be putting the hurt my enemy than trying to keep minor buffs alive on myself. If NR is so bad, I have two suggestions: 1)kill the spirit first, or 2) stay out of it's range. In a team of 8, it can't be that hard to kill, even at lvl 10 (spirits are always relatively weak).

There's my 2 cents. I love this game. I look forward to every session I get for playing. Keep up the good work.

Dan Mega · Aug 04, 2005, 09:28 PM // 21:28

Gaile, let me just repeat this again:

There is no "problem" with Nature's Renewal or Spirit Groups. Its just that many people are not good enough at the game to beat it, thus they want it nerfed.

PS- My spirit team just got beaten. Booya, its not invinvcible.

Tactical-Dillusions · Aug 04, 2005, 09:32 PM // 21:32

What new items?

Give us their names....

rii · Aug 04, 2005, 09:41 PM // 21:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dan Mega

Gaile, let me just repeat this again:

There is no "problem" with Nature's Renewal or Spirit Groups. Its just that many people are not good enough at the game to beat it, thus they want it nerfed.

PS- My spirit team just got beaten. Booya, its not invinvcible.

hey, admins, if i promise not to have the intention of flaming, or trying to start a flame, and make all my other posts as coherent, logical, and backed up with reason, can i just tell someone to stfu once a day, as opposed to the following rhetoric that i normally spew? ive got two weeks holiday so ifs thats ok with you ill store it up

???

nr does need a nerf. *boggles*. one skill kills smite (more or less), it kills healing balls, it kills some air builds (some use attunement), it kills half of the skills, and while that does leave another half to play with (so its buildable around of course), ask yourself this:

'did the person who invented this skill want to render half of the rest of them useless (that they probably conceptualised)?' if so, why did they even bother making any other skills?

its obviously limiting originality and that isnt good. its wasting entire lines to throw in skills, and that isnt good. its boring, and that isnt good. You can use enchants and hexes under nr, but is it really worth it? 99% of cases need not bother.

Quintus · Aug 04, 2005, 09:50 PM // 21:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ensign

Because some ignorant little shit always insists on stating that Nature's Renewal is balanced despite backing that assertion up with absolutely nothing, then proceeds to insult everyone who's stated otherwise by calling them some combination of idiotic, lazy, or whiners.

I think that Dan Mega's post might just be the perfect example of your point.

SantaClause · Aug 04, 2005, 09:56 PM // 21:56

Like most other PvE'ers im looking forward to the new updates. I do have some concerns though. What happens 2 weeks after the update when we have explored and developed farming methods for the new area? Wait 3 months for another 2 weeks worth of content? Not me, I dont care to farm for worthless gold and weapons.

I am hoping the the good group of developers can come up with some replay value in other ways. What about a PvP free for all, similar to FPS deathmatch? I guess Im relying on the more creative minds to keep me playing because after this new area Im not sure that I will keep playing.

Aug 04, 2005, 10:00 PM // 22:00

Most of that letter was point blank-useless. It seemed to me like a longer version of stringed responses from the PR machine in ArenaNet's office. Guess I know what Gaile got James Phinney for christmas.

Ok here is what I liked: You admit that there are problems with PvP. You sound as if you took some of the ideas from the alpha forums that I last remember and ran with them. Balancing before tournaments and ladder seasons? Good. Dynamic balancing is always a great thing.

Here is what I didn't like: You said you've tested these changes, I dont think they were tested enough. There are some glaring balance issues still around and that State of the Game letter just led me to believe you guys are incredibly blind. James Phinney only addressed FotM concerns, and only one of those so far is an issue at all. In other words I'm not sure if you guys listened to the detailed posts about what makes something overpowered or not, or you just went to the VN boards and started qouting the latest guy upset about dying to Air gank. Sounds like you are prepared to fix the basic problems with skills by tweaking numbers, but are failing to acknowledge the other problems. This includes the near extinction level of Necromancers for PvP, Enchantment Removal being shit as it has been since December, Soul Reaping being shit, Zealots fire triggering on anything, Expertise affecting everything except spells, Channeling not even behaving anything like it's skill description, forgetting to balance the PvP maps or change them for god knows how long, still not addressing the order in which some skills stack, not letting out enough information about wtf is going in PvP to begin with so new players cant get better, screwing up skill acquisition, PvE being a pile of shit that can be soloed with 3 protection spells and henchies, and overall just losing focus. There are other things I don't like but I'll leave those issues aside and watch the next month to see how the game turns. I'm this close to leaving like so many others:
|GW---------------|-Starcraft|

Hopefully you guys get it together and proofread what you put on the back of that retail box and end the August 2005 Beta Test already.

P.S.: The other day I was playing Starcraft and caught 2 n0 members in a pub on U.S. East. Gee, looks like that intensive PvP testing in the alpha is going *so* well.

Vex · Aug 04, 2005, 10:01 PM // 22:01

My biggest complaint currently is the econemy. Other then that everything that I do in the game is fine. I do PvP once in a great while but not to where I need to have a UAS button. I think the fact that they mentioned making gaining those skills easyer is another big step. Hopefully it will ease up on the flame wars between PvPers and what they call "carebears" & "Fan Boys". Personally I was getting tierd of having to sift through posts to find something Intelligent to read. The flaming and so called disscusions that had been going on were nothing but a word war and not to mention people saying fix this then not giving advice on what to fix.

I do like the fact that IQ made a topic to disscuss what needs to be done and lots of Ideas on how to do it. Now if they could shape up some of their guildmates and tell them to stop flamming everyone they may get took seriously by A.Net Shensi dosnt help the guild name with all the Snide remarks to people and EXSPECIALLY Gaile. Other then that they are doing a good job of keeping things organized and to the point.

Old Dood · Aug 04, 2005, 10:15 PM // 22:15

We need a real Crowd Control in place. A visable Force that stops Grievers,Abusers,Racists,Imature,Vulger,etc... people from ruining the game for others.

Minor offenses/First Times: Warnings, Public Jails/Stocks in town centers

Secondary offenses: Branding their Armor so everyone can see it. (Wave a mouse over their armor and we can see the offense.)

Major offenses: Banning with Public Executions of the banned character.

It would be nice to actually SEE these people being caught and judged for the violations of the EULA. Once this is in place then people will think twice before they commit a violation toward others.

Beta Ray Bill · Aug 04, 2005, 10:29 PM // 22:29

I have to admit that Blackace is right on at least one thing: the letter didn't address the primary concerns of most players from these forums. I like the addition of new content and I don't care about the nerfs so much, but at least let us know that the major issues we've discovered for the game are at least on a docket to be reviewed in the near future.

Granted, you guys have your work cut out for you. I certainly don't envy the position you're in with the forums full of bickering amongst players and threads devoted to flame wars over tweaks that should/shouldn't be implemented. It can't be easy, and it's most certainly discouraging sometimes. That's why I say "keep up the good work." You've delivered a stable, functional product (for the most part) and are constantly making efforts to improve it while developing future content at the same time. Your plate is definitely full.

I don't know what happens in halls of ArenaNet, and I've never been privy to a board meeting, so I can't say this with credibility, but I think a restatement of your mission with Guild Wars needs to be made. Get back to your original vision and stick to it.

Nearly every complaint I've read has this basic sentiment between the lines: "It doesn't do what I want it to do. Make it easier for me." I don't care who denies it, everyone wants an experience that will cater to their idea of fun and deliver the maximum level of it. Unfortunately, not everyone has the same idea of what a fun game should be. In the end, with patches and nerfs and buffs and whatever, we're left with a game that tries to be everything to everyone and usually fails on both accounts. Do what you think is best for the game, not what you think will keep people from leaving. If it's the best it can be, it'll find it's niche.

And again, thanks for your hard work. I, for one, am fully enjoying GW and plan to for a long time.

Aria · Aug 04, 2005, 10:31 PM // 22:31

Hello everyone

Since I've already deleted over ten posts, I'm going to say this once, and only once. This thread is going to be under heavy moderation. I don't want to see arguments about whether or not Nature's Renewal is overpowered, underpowered, etc, and I don't wish to see any type of near-flaming banter on any individual of this forum.

Please stick to the topic, or else your post will be deleted without warning. If you have something constructive to say about your thoughts on the game, whether they're positive OR negative, please please share your thoughts. However, please do so in a polite, non-inflammatory manner. Any attempts to derail this thread into one of the many other debates around here will be deleted. If you wish to go on at length about how runners are horrible human beings and ruin the moral integrity of the game, or share your conspiracy theories about Guild Wars and ANet, please do so in another thread.

Otherwise, let's keep this thread for what it's meant to do: a form of valuable feedback of not only the things that you appreciate, but those issues (good or bad) that you personally see foremost as crucial for a better experience of Guild Wars.

MSecorsky · Aug 04, 2005, 10:33 PM // 22:33

Guilty, apologies. For some reason buttons got pushed that shouldn't have.

PieXags · Aug 04, 2005, 10:45 PM // 22:45

I didn't get much from the letter. Yeah, we know the summer updates are coming. That's dandy, we've known that for a while. Yeah, we know there are some problems in PvP, we're the ones playing the game like hell.

Basically the letter was a great big "we're working on some things". And that's not saying much more than we already know. We know you're working on things, that's common sense. We know there will *eventually* be summer updates, that's great, we've known that for months as well. I guess the most depressing thing is that this "state of the game letter" has been in "production" for a while now, I remember a post from Gaile a while back about it. And this is it? We're the ones playing the game enthusiastically, we read the news whenever it's released, we know that you're working on things. What we don't know (and would like to) is just what the hell's going to happen with the game as a whole, some possible release dates, specific details on further updates possibly, that sort of thing I'd go for. The state of the game letter didn't reveal to me anything I hadn't known for a good week or two really.

Drakron · Aug 04, 2005, 10:58 PM // 22:58

Well this is in a nutshell the state of the game for me.

Stop playing over a week ago because its boring.

Ensign · Aug 04, 2005, 11:09 PM // 23:09

Ascended Content

Meh. More bots to kill. I'll play through it once, but if the money isn't better than solo underworld farming it really doesn't matter.

Character Advancement

Cranking up the quality of loot that drops is a neccessary change. Changes to 'farming' so far have all been nerfs that made it increasingly difficult for people to acquire good equipment for their characters, when what should have happened is a raising of the quality of loot across the board. You see lots of botting and boring farming runs because there are very few areas in the game that still have reasonable value/time ratios. I assure you that if people could make comparable amounts of money simply running missions with their friends, they would.

As far as accessability issues, there are two serious ones at the moment. First, weapon upgrades. They are only available from rare weapons, which don't drop with any frequency, and even then it's unlikely that you'll pull an actually good upgrade. This would likely be addressed by changes to the drop rate. The other is collector items. There are still several important PvP-neccessary items that are not available from collectors - 15%>50 swords, hammers, and axes, 20/20 healing staves, strength shields - that need to be added still. Putting those into the game would allow PvE characters to be competitive with PvP characters.

Getting faction more quickly would be nice, but there's still one important step that needs to be taken - giving players the ability to spend their faction with a PvP character. You could unlock your account with faction in theory, except that you have to have a high-level PvE character with access to most of the map if you actually want to spend it.

On that note, why isn't there at least a storage agent in the Guild Hall? A lot of people use Guild Halls for things other than GvG, so why not improve their utility?

PvP Playbalance

"We have tried to balance Guild Wars to allow for this metagame without allowing the loss of balanced builds and diverse strategies."

Congratulations, you did a decent job for a first try but several mistakes still slipped through. This isn't a knock, no one has ever gotten balance right on the first try. But you have a ton of data from actual, competitive matches from top guilds now. Let Izzy do his job. That's all I have to say about this.

"With this in mind, we have been testing a variety of playbalance adjustments internally for some weeks now."

ZoS and Amazon Basin casting Searing Heat on each other does not constitute testing. Sorry. The good guilds are all out of the test now, and even besides that you have a much better source of data and feedback now - the thousands of matches being played every day on the live server. The closed test makes sense for finding bugs and doing a rough pass on new content, but balance should no longer be part of that process.

"We will let players know in advance when playbalance changes are coming so that private tournaments are not disrupted too abruptly."

That's good. I understand that you did not want to make playbalance changes in the past after what happened to KOR during the Korean tournament. But even with a week's notice of a new change, I don't think there would be a problem. Balance is a mess right now. As long as people have a chance to prepare for coming changes, they can take that into account as they progress through whatever tournament. Changing skills is always going to irk someone, but let's face it, it has to be done. Don't shy away from it.

Observer Mode

Just get it in already. It's an invaluable tool that's a neccessary step towards making this game more competitive.

Peace,
-CxE

Sleet · Aug 04, 2005, 11:32 PM // 23:32

I think Observer mode should be a priority for you. And please make it only for guild mates or with permission. IE:

If player X want to observe a top GvG he should ask for permission from two guilds, ofcorse ppl from same guild which is alredy fighting should be able to watch the match.

___________
My english is not so happy xD

PhineasToke · Aug 04, 2005, 11:48 PM // 23:48

I am very concerned by the number of players in general (lowered districts), my Guild members, and friends who have left the game permanently. I am also very concerned by how few new players I meet in pre-seared. I keep a pre character just for observing the world, and mostly I see veteran players recasting characters.

Is it because of replayability, grinding, or some other factor I am unaware of? I am also very concerned by the lack of marketing of the game outside of the hardcore game magazines. I earned my Degree in Marketing in 1974, and although I have not used my knowledge commercially in a few years, the basics till hold true. I've seen no MSM advertising that would appeal to the casual gamer who doesn't want to play their kids Xbox or Playstation. Even my Daughter, who is an avid PC gamer, has been hesitant to commit to the game because it hasn't caught her or her friends attention. And they are PC gamers, not just console fixated.

Just a few thoughts. I'd like to be sure that the longevity of GW is equal to or better than the powerhouse titles available.

Thanks.

Karn Jazzik · Aug 04, 2005, 11:52 PM // 23:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by asdar

cannot make it go away except by using the same strategy. There's never been a strategy that is as dominant in the Tombs except for the Monk Balthazar's strat that got nerfed to a reasonable level. Spikers/smiters/necro pets/conditions and even all the way back to War/Mo's all had counters to them within any build but not NR. Even without it affecting hex's it would be too strong, any ranger with no skill other than NR and Oath shot can come into the Tombs and you have to play their game to win and that's a no enchantment, no hex based style of play. The games too simplistic as it is without stripping two of the biggest skill lines out of HoH play.

Never a truer word spoken, and they removed the only counter, Unnatural Signet is gone.. nothing can be done about NR... it completely disables a mesmer who might aswell be carrying a banner saying interupt me!! and it strips all enchants of anything within 200yrds!! its crazed.

Life bond builds, spikes, everything like that has a counter, there is nothing to do against these NR teams.. I mean yeah you can interupt the ranger, black him out, spinal shivers the little swine, but if theres more than one? what ya gunna do.. black em both out, leave the healers alive, cant tangle it all at once.. but a NR can destroy an entire team.